Some newbie help?

[ikarius]

Hiyas,
So, I'm currently fiddling about with Portralis 0.3, and I'd like a little guidance. I've got a few questions which would really help out.

1. What exactly are Licialhyd's? It looks like the are supposed to raise stats or skills, and I'm guessing they are temporary, but nothing says... so, approximately how long do they last? I used a Licialhyd of healing that I started with, and afterwards looked at my character screen, and it still indicated that my healing skill was 0... is that a bug?

2. XP - it seems quite hard to get XP.... I've entered dungeons and killed things, and keep getting no XP. I managed to jump from no XP to level 2 by killing a giant rat boss, but then nothing else would give me XP at all, even when I went outside of town and entered a random dungeon and killed stuff- the monster window indicated that everything I killed was worth 0 XP to me.

3. I'm interested in playing with the enchanter class; I'd like to go enchanter up to the point he can make some pretty burly equipment then head over to a fighting class to pick up some combat skills. I'm thinking human, as their skill bonus will be helpful. So, I need to start out mage, but I'd rather avoid spending many points on anything other than the entry requirements for enchanter. Any recommendations on the most bang for the buck routes to allow me to kill enough critters to qualify into the enchanter class?

I'm sure I'll have more questions later, but those are the immediate ones.

Cheers
Ikarius

[ikarius]

Oh yah, one more q;

1. I'm seeing melee-immune critters show up on the first dungeon level; both in the in-town dungeon and the out-of-town random dungeon. Recommendations on early tactics for dealing with those? And when are damage-returning critters likely to show up?

--Ikarius

[Variaz]

First of all, thanks for trying out Portralis!

1. What exactly are Licialhyd's? It looks like the are supposed to raise stats or skills, and I'm guessing they are temporary, but nothing says... so, approximately how long do they last? I used a Licialhyd of healing that I started with, and afterwards looked at my character screen, and it still indicated that my healing skill was 0... is that a bug?

Some licialhyds works like curative potions. The Healing licialhyd, for example, restores hp. It doesn't raise your Healing skill. Other licialhyds such as Physical Resistance or Raise <Stat> temporarely gives you resistance or raise a stat by an amount equal to the Licialhyd's power. The duration is also equal to the power. And as to what IS a Licialhyd, it's a type of crystal that is widely used in the Portralis universe, and considered one of the greatest discoveries ever! A lot of things are based around the Licialhyd, and as I develop the story, they will be involved in a lot of things.

2. XP - it seems quite hard to get XP.... I've entered dungeons and killed things, and keep getting no XP. I managed to jump from no XP to level 2 by killing a giant rat boss, but then nothing else would give me XP at all, even when I went outside of town and entered a random dungeon and killed stuff- the monster window indicated that everything I killed was worth 0 XP to me.

When killing a monster, you gain a minimum experience equal to 1 + (difference between the monster's level and your level). But if you're level 2 and kill a level 1 enemy, you gain (1 + (-1)), so you don't gain anything. You will also gain a regular experience amount that can vary from monsters to monsters, like the regular Vanilla angband, but early game enemies aren't worth any base experience.

In quests, or any special levels or when inside a building(we call it "quest level" here... ), you will not gain any experience for kills, except for Unique monsters. That's why the tiny rats didn't give anything, but the monstrous rat was worth something.

My advice is to go down to level 2, raise your level to 3, then go down to 3. Starting at experience level 4, monsters will get a little boost to their levels based on your own, so you'll find more enemies that are worth experience.

3. I'm interested in playing with the enchanter class; I'd like to go enchanter up to the point he can make some pretty burly equipment then head over to a fighting class to pick up some combat skills. I'm thinking human, as their skill bonus will be helpful. So, I need to start out mage, but I'd rather avoid spending many points on anything other than the entry requirements for enchanter. Any recommendations on the most bang for the buck routes to allow me to kill enough critters to qualify into the enchanter class?

Early on, I'd say focus on Crafting and put some points into Dexterity instead of intelligence(NEVER neglect your Dex when playing a melee character, unless you have another way of getting to_h.) You do not actually need Mage levels to get Enchanter, just the stats and skills. You'll be able to customize the bonus on what you craft to suit whatever style you want to adopt. In fact, since you're a beginner, you will probably enjoy the versatility of the Enchanter, as you'll be able to "rollback" if you don't like a particular skill by creating new equipment.

[Variaz]

1. I'm seeing melee-immune critters show up on the first dungeon level; both in the in-town dungeon and the out-of-town random dungeon. Recommendations on early tactics for dealing with those? And when are damage-returning critters likely to show up?

Here's some tips:

1. Use a branded weapon. You may have found one on another elite monster before, or if you have a Poison potion or something like that, you can use your Alchemy to brand your weapons.
2. Use a spell. Any classes can use magic as long as you have mana or enough Wisdom. Buy the Magic Missile book, and create a basic magic missile spell. Later on, you can turn into Elemental Lord, and get Element Strike.
3. Run. No one likes running away, but sometimes, it's the best way to avoid trouble. A good idea is to always carry a few scrollf of Teleportation. They are EXTREMELY useful in Portralis.

Returns can show up at any times, be ready for them. For melee returning, keep in mind that they return normal melee attacks, but not special abilities that does physical damages. So if you use Spin Attack, Accurate Strike, Sword Spin or similar ability, you won't take any damages.

Another tip I can give you is that melee returnings are broken in the current version and do not work, so you don't have to worry about them.

[ikarius]

Cool, thanks for the tips. Umm, one other question I've got is... what the heck is a "Between Gate" ? Do they ever take you to a different level, or only between gates on the current level?

[Variaz]

Some kind of portal that will bring elsewhere on the current level. An old relic of old PernAngband, but it's kinda cool, so I left it for now.

[ikarius]

Thanks, for the quick replies, and for portralis. I'm pretty excited at the complex character system, and at the fact that you've moved a bunch of the game code outboard to lua- finally a roguelike I can hack on without recompiling!


Beyond gates were a bit scary, cause I wasn't sure if I might end up on another dungeon level... that woulda been DANGEROUS!

What's your take on the survivability of a dual-wield enchanter?

[sekira]

Welcome to the greatest angband variant every made, Portralis.

First I would like to say that for a beginner, going the enchanter route will be a good idea. Since you are going enchanter, then human is an excellent race choice, they get a bonus to both the skills needed to enter the enchanter class, crafting and alchemy.

The human bonus to crafting and enchanting means you can put only 16 base skill points in each skill to get it to the required 20 skill for the enchanter class.

If you plan on eventually going the melee route, then you will probably want to focus on wisdom based casting instead of mana based casting. The heavy armor that melee characters rely on will reduce your mana, and wearing gauntlets then also cuts your mana in half. Wisdom casting is not affected by your armor at all. Mana casting is usually better suited for those who plan to specialize in casting and avoid most melee.

you will get 2 stat points each level to raise your stats, and 5 skill points each level (+1 additional skill point every 3rd level, because you are human race) and 1 ability point each level, plus you start with an ability point (AP).

You will notice that the enchanter class also requires 20 int, in addition to the crafting and alchemy. Don't bother putting any of your level stat points in int, as that is the mana casting stat. You will be able to use your crafting skill to create equipment with the int needed to enter the class. Also, I suggest that you not put very many points in wis, even though you will be wis casting. You can craft that eq as you need it too. I recommend you spending your precious stat points on dex (as Variaz suggested) and also con (every class and play style benefits greatly from con, especially in the early levels)

So spend all your skill points from levels 2, 3, and 4 on crafting, which should bring the skill to 20 with your racial bonus, and then spend all the skill points from level 5, 6, and 7 on alchemy, which should bring the skill to 20 with your racial bonus as well.

Spend your stat points from levels 2 through 7 pretty evenly on dex and con, with perhaps a couple points in wis if you choose.

where to spend your Abillity points? I suggest starting out as a priest, and spend your first ability point on Divine blood, and your AP from level 2 on Holy Might. These two abilities are quite useful for a low level character, especially a beginner to portralis. Divine blood will heal you for 5 hp every single turn for each AP in the ability, which lets you mostly ignore poison and any minor healing needed from combat. Divine Might is a passive ability, meaning you don't have to activate it, and it is always on, no matter what. Holy Might is an active ability that you activate for a short boost to your fighting abilities (bless and physical resistance) and an even shorter boost to your speed (haste). You might consider an AP in the Mace of Heaven ability as well, which lets you create out of thin air an enchanted mace with a light brand, allowing you to defeat physical immune monsters.

A couple things to be aware of in portralis:

When you die, you don't delete. You just lose all your eq and start over in town with 1 hp.

You can store gold in your home. to create a pile a gold in your inventory (stocked from your gold on hand) use the y command. ALWAYS put all your gold in a pile and put it in your home before you enter a dungeon or quest. That way if you die, you have something to start over with. You might even consider stocking your home with "starter sets" of eq so you can get going in a hurry. Things that you can always stock right off would be scrolls of teleport, scrolls of word of recall, and food. It will be nice for you as an enchanter, you can take a little gold from your home and then go buy equipment and decompose it and craft it into magic equipment. Other characters have to rely on their skills and stats from level gains, and when they die, they get to go buy non magical eq to start over with.

regarding dual wielding, that can be quite fun at higher levels, but at low level it is difficult with anything other than daggers. Daggers at low level are not that effective unless you have a method of branding them reliably, such as the rogue's poison brand ability. You can brand them with damaging potions you find using your alchemy skill (after the alchemy skill is 10 or more) but finding damaging potions at very low levels is not relaible at all. If you really want to give it a shot, go for it, see how it works. If it doesn't work out, you can just craft a shield next time around

[Variaz]

I'd say put 20 of your skill points into Dual Wield. That will give you the "Ambidexterity" passive feat, meaning that you'll get the same amount of blows from both hands. After that, use your crafted gear to pump up your Dual Wield skill, and place your natural skill points into something else, like a weapon skill, Defense, Agility or Magic Defense.

Here's another tip regarding Defense and Agility. To maximize your AC, it's better to raise both skills than focusing into one. Defense is nice, and so is Agility, but Defense AND Agility, now you're talking. Both skills don't need to be extremely high to be effective, so don't forget to keep some points for Magic Defense, which is also very important!

[ikarius]

All very useful info! ;D

So, if I want to dual-wield Katanas, so I can pick up "parry" plus the dual-wield stuff; what's the interaction like between Strength, Dex, dual-wield and blows/round?

[Variaz]

The number of extra attacks you get would be this:

((Str + Dex) / 2) / (weapon's weight)

So assuming a Steel Katana with a weight of 14. For every 14 points of average between Strength and Dexterity, you gain an extra attack.

For dual wielding steel katanas without penalities, you would need a dual wield skill of 42. Note that Mithril and Blue Steel katanas have a weight of 10, so for them, you only need 30.

As for Parry, parrying works differently now. (the help is outdated). Basically, if your weapon has any bonus to base AC, or you have a passive ability to parry(as is the case with Swords after a certain skill level), you'll have a chance to block based on the base AC bonus, your dexterity and the monster's dexterity. And if you wield two weapons, the test is applied twice, so that part is true.

[sekira]

I do know that the number of blows you get with a single weapon is 1 + ((str + dex)/2) / (wgt of weapon) + extra blows from equipment (crafting can help this), so you need 28 total str and dex to get 1 extra blow with a 14 lb katana, but you can just get plusses to your generic extra blows from equipment, which is probably your best bet for getting lots of attacks with a katana.

I think you get half that number of blows with the second weapon unless dual wield has 20 base skill points in it (not skill points from equipment, but your own skill points you spend each level)

finally, both weapons get a penalty to the number of blows that is ((wgt * 3) - dual wield skill) / 5. So with 0 dual wield, and 2 katanas at 14 lbs each... that is - 8 blows for each weapon, with a minimum of 1 blow each hand. So with 14 lb weapons, you need (14 * 3) = 42 dual wield skill (from both base points and equipment bonuses) to get 0 penalty to your blows for both weapons. This is kinda pricey in terms of both your base skill (which then can not be used to increase crafting and let you craft better stuff) and also in terms of your bonuses from crafting (which you then can't use to boost other stuff)

Like I said, it is pretty difficult at low levels to dual wield anything other than daggers. Daggers are always less than 2 lbs, giving them LOTS of blows to begin with from str and dex, and also giving them very small penalties to their blows from dual wielding.

[ikarius]

Got it. Swords ability comes in later in the character development, then. Brands for dmg vs physical-immune critters, just gotta figure out what to do about explosive-breeding critters. Thanks very much for helping me figure this out! ;D


--Ikarius

[sekira]

Well, swords and dual wielding will probably come later in development, but you can use a single sword and a shield just fine. A sword (such as a katana or a sabre) will do a lot more damage per blow than a dagger will.

Keep in mind that swords will perform better at most of the active abilities that are based on your weapon damage such as spin attack, accurate strike, elemental strike, etc. The reason they do better is because of the way those abilities (called combat feats) activate. You can either explicitly activate them for a single attack, or if you invest in the combat feats skill, then your normal blows just from walking into a monster can be converted into one of your combat feat active abilities. Look through the abilities help file for abilities that say (Active, Level ?, combat feat). those are the ones that you can use to replace a normal blow during an attack.

So if you have that big katana that does 5 times the damage of the puny dagger per blow, that means each spin attack does 5 times the damage. If you have no combat feats skill, you can still just activate your combat feat abilities to get a single attack with that ability, which is going to be 5 times as effective with a sword than it will be with a dagger. Also if you invest in combat feats skill, for every 5 points in the combat feats skill, you can convert a normal attack to a combat feat ability that you have. that means that 10 points in the combat feats skill is going to convert 2 attacks. Do you want those attacks to be with dagger damage or with sword damage? To get the same effectiveness with daggers you would need about 50 skill in the combat feats skill, so you could convert 10 dagger attacks, which is close to the same damage as 2 sword attacks.

Not to mention that if you craft equipment with that bonus to extra attacks... it costs a flat number of tweak points to get +1 to your number of attacks, regardless if your weapon is 1 lb or 40 lbs, and regardless if the base damage with that weapon is 1d3 or 3d8.

So daggers are good if you can brand them, and they aren't terrible even if you don't brand them. They kinda don't work well with combat feats, and they don't need you to craft eq with bonus extra attacks, as they get lots of attacks without those bonuses.

Bigger weapons benefit more from combat feats skill, and also from bonus extra attacks from your crafted eq.

Unlike other angband variants, it isn't all about your number of attacks with portralis. It is balanced here. Lots of attacks are good, but it means each one does a lot less damage, and less attacks isn't as bad, because it is doing a lot more damage per attack.

[Variaz]

Another ability you can consider with Daggers is the Fighter's Critical Hits. With a high number of blows, it has a very high chance of success, and could be very helpful. The paralysis doesn't work on all enemies, but it's still very useful(and even if it doesn't stun, it can still do double damages).